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#169481 - 12/18/19 07:12 PM Re: William Webster speaks up [Re: Shrike1]
Mike F Offline
enthusiast


Registered: 08/28/08
Posts: 155
Loc: Chico, CA.
So far, I'm seeing here nothing but accusations competing for "moral high ground."
_________________________
"Iím still the Presidentís wing-man, so Iím there with my boy." ~Eric Holder

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#169482 - 12/18/19 07:53 PM Re: William Webster speaks up [Re: Shrike1]
Peter McKenna Offline
old hand


Registered: 06/07/13
Posts: 1167
Loc: Louisiana
The FISA application was prepared using the Steele Dossier as its primary evidentiary support and declared Carter Page an agent of a foreign power. The FBI received the Steele Dossier on Sept 16, 2016, approximately a month and a half after the initiation of the Russian Collusion investigation. Page was included as part of the investigation at the beginning.

The FBI received the now-discredited Steele Dossier almost immediately after the DNC and Hillary Clintonís campaign received it from Fusion GPS.

Now how did a dossier prepared by a British National to dig up dirt on the Trump campaign find its was into the hands of the FBI so quickly? And why was exculpatory evidence excluded from the FISA application?

Note that Horowitz did not say the investigation was ďjustifiedĒ just that it met the minimum threshold per FBI procedure. Horowitz did express concern that there may be political bias at work although he could find no direct evidence.



https://www.wsj.com/amp/articles/a-trail-of-fbi-abuse-11575938300



https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/12/n...collusion-book/




Edited by Peter McKenna (12/18/19 07:57 PM)
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Peter McKenna

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#169483 - 12/18/19 09:02 PM Re: William Webster speaks up [Re: Shrike1]
Enright Offline
Super User


Registered: 05/17/06
Posts: 3582
Loc: CA
 Originally Posted By: Shrike1
 Originally Posted By: Enright
Perhaps he'll go to jail like Clinton did for rape.


You do know that Trump has been accused of rape as well don't you? On more than one occasion. One of which happened to be his ex-wife.

Conservatives lost any moral high ground they thought they had when they accepted Donald Trump as the president.

Greg


She said she did not scream because everything happened so quickly. Her upper lip was bruised and swollen after the encounter because, she said, he had grabbed onto it with his mouth.

"The last thing he said to me was, 'You better get some ice for that.' And he put on his sunglasses and walked out the door," she recalled.

Several friends of Broaddrick's backed up the story. Norma Rogers, who was director of nursing at Broaddrick's nursing home at the time, told reporters that she entered the hotel room shortly after the assault allegedly took place, and "found Mrs. Broaddrick crying and in 'a state of shock.' Her upper lip was puffed out and blue, and appeared to have been hit." Kelsey elaborated to the New York Times, "She told me he forced himself on her, forced her to have intercourse."
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Jim

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#169484 - 12/18/19 09:55 PM Re: William Webster speaks up [Re: Enright]
Shrike1 Offline
veteran


Registered: 09/27/05
Posts: 1359
Loc: Greenville, NC
 Originally Posted By: Enright
 Originally Posted By: Shrike1
 Originally Posted By: Enright
Perhaps he'll go to jail like Clinton did for rape.


You do know that Trump has been accused of rape as well don't you? On more than one occasion. One of which happened to be his ex-wife.

Conservatives lost any moral high ground they thought they had when they accepted Donald Trump as the president.

Greg


She said she did not scream because everything happened so quickly. Her upper lip was bruised and swollen after the encounter because, she said, he had grabbed onto it with his mouth.

"The last thing he said to me was, 'You better get some ice for that.' And he put on his sunglasses and walked out the door," she recalled.

Several friends of Broaddrick's backed up the story. Norma Rogers, who was director of nursing at Broaddrick's nursing home at the time, told reporters that she entered the hotel room shortly after the assault allegedly took place, and "found Mrs. Broaddrick crying and in 'a state of shock.' Her upper lip was puffed out and blue, and appeared to have been hit." Kelsey elaborated to the New York Times, "She told me he forced himself on her, forced her to have intercourse."


And?

There are just as many, if not more accusations out there against Trump. Their stories could be posted here just like this one. I'm not taking the time or effort to do so because it's common knowledge, just like the accusations against Clinton.

Now if we want to get back to Michael Cohen and his case where Donald Trump signed a check to him (while Trump was in the White House as president) for repayment after Michael paid off Stormy Daniels for him, that would be more useful. Donald Trump is an unindicted co-conspirator in this case and is not being charged only because of the ridiculous OIC opinion at the Justice Department. Like Trump said he could shoot someone in the middle of New York City and according to him and his lawyers nobody could do anything about it.

Greg
_________________________
Words can't define what I feel inside
Who needs them? -- Smashing Pumpkins "GEEK U.S.A."

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#169485 - 12/19/19 04:53 AM Re: William Webster speaks up [Re: Shrike1]
Enright Offline
Super User


Registered: 05/17/06
Posts: 3582
Loc: CA
 Originally Posted By: Shrike1
 Originally Posted By: Enright
 Originally Posted By: Shrike1
 Originally Posted By: Enright
Perhaps he'll go to jail like Clinton did for rape.


You do know that Trump has been accused of rape as well don't you? On more than one occasion. One of which happened to be his ex-wife.

Conservatives lost any moral high ground they thought they had when they accepted Donald Trump as the president.

Greg


She said she did not scream because everything happened so quickly. Her upper lip was bruised and swollen after the encounter because, she said, he had grabbed onto it with his mouth.

"The last thing he said to me was, 'You better get some ice for that.' And he put on his sunglasses and walked out the door," she recalled.

Several friends of Broaddrick's backed up the story. Norma Rogers, who was director of nursing at Broaddrick's nursing home at the time, told reporters that she entered the hotel room shortly after the assault allegedly took place, and "found Mrs. Broaddrick crying and in 'a state of shock.' Her upper lip was puffed out and blue, and appeared to have been hit." Kelsey elaborated to the New York Times, "She told me he forced himself on her, forced her to have intercourse."


And?

There are just as many, if not more accusations out there against Trump. Their stories could be posted here just like this one. I'm not taking the time or effort to do so because it's common knowledge, just like the accusations against Clinton.

Now if we want to get back to Michael Cohen and his case where Donald Trump signed a check to him (while Trump was in the White House as president) for repayment after Michael paid off Stormy Daniels for him, that would be more useful. Donald Trump is an unindicted co-conspirator in this case and is not being charged only because of the ridiculous OIC opinion at the Justice Department. Like Trump said he could shoot someone in the middle of New York City and according to him and his lawyers nobody could do anything about it.

Greg


I wasn't counting or matching accusations of course, just citing this account because of its particularly brutal nature, and the witness verification of the wound.

It seems to me that Trump never said he could shoot someone in the middle of New York City and nobody could do anything about it.

Also, unless things have changed, Donald Trump is not an unindicted co-conspirator. "Unlike President Nixon, who had been named an unindicted coconspirator in an indictment handed down by a grand jury, Trump has not been accused by a grand jury indictment of anything thus far. Cohenís guilty plea and allocution cannot turn the president into an unindicted coconspirator. Only a grand jury can."ĖAlan Dershowitz
_________________________
Jim

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#169487 - 12/19/19 04:53 PM Re: William Webster speaks up [Re: Shrike1]
Epo9 Offline
enthusiast


Registered: 06/28/11
Posts: 238
Loc: US
 Originally Posted By: Shrike1
 Originally Posted By: Epo9
I can appreciate your frustration with the latter scandal you've mentioned and any boorish behavior that regularly surfaces from the president these days. I'm nonetheless well prepared to have the Russian asset wildcard that's regularly levied against conservative figures (and evidently liberal senators on occasion) filed away with all of the identity-based black sheep tags that the far left enjoys stapling on its opposition. If two years of investigation couldn't make the link, I doubt labeling Putin as Trump's puppet master is reasonable, and this statement unfortunately prefaced everything you placed below. I suppose my sensibilities to these claims have been hardened enough that I was willing to read past it.

I'm sure we're in agreement that any guilty public figures should be appropriately prosecuted in the face of clear evidence, but it might pay to be less hasty to extrapolate such evidence on the basis of one's leanings.


This response to me could just as easily have been in response to others in this thread who have already (without any evidence), thrown others in jail.

Perhaps your leanings blocked your view of their posts?

There was plenty of linkage in those two years of investigation. Just not enough to prove a criminal conspiracy. And DT's own actions during his presidency show just how much of a puppet he is to Vladimir Putin.

Greg


What leanings might those be? You may be interested to hear where I'd land on a political spectrum scale. And to be fair to your point, there's plenty that conservatives here have said that I'd of course disagree with, but I'm not terribly active of late. The climate these days are just particularly triggering for those obsessed with Trump's presidency (and not saying you fall in this camp by any means). Your first line more drew my contention here.

If there's a substantial link or treasonous crimes imputed to Trump, I'd be happy to hear about it. But two years of wasted investigation with nothing but a circular obstruction claim followed by all of these impeachment hearings for articles not containing any actual crimes and not proving anything substantial has worn me a bit on this. It can be tiring to hear my hard left relatives wax on about how democratic lawmakers like Biden and the Clintons are "shamelessly" smeared and then tersely assert how certain folks in and outside of their camp are Russian assets. There's just no way this isn't partisan hive-think.

The substantive stuff you've added in this thread about Trump has merit for sure. But several of us that lean left in ways recognize that these tactics I initially described have been used before him and will likely be used after him.

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