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#150880 - 10/15/13 05:04 AM Re: The Abominable - reviewed [Re: Enright]
Rabbit Offline
enthusiast


Registered: 01/29/12
Posts: 116
 Originally Posted By: Enright
Well, I made the mistake on a whim of going on Amazon and looking at the Abominable and reading the fascinating introduction, so I'm in a dither until the book comes out. Not knowing diddly about him, I was so drawn to Mr. Perry, the real-life mountaineer, and I kept thinking how fortunate it was that he was still alive when Dan met him and all, one of the great coincidences, and I really wished that I had had a chance to know him too. Now (as in the meaning of now to be the present), I understand some people are insisting that the great and aforementioned Mr. Perry is a fictional character, of all the absurd things, and I just want to shake some sense into them. NOOOOO way.


So, Mr Jake Perry is not a fictional character and Mr Simmons really did meet with him?

ps

Sorry for the post, I found the answer myself, I quote from amazon:

 Quote:
Editorial Reviews
From Publishers Weekly
Even Jake Perry, the fictional travelogue author Dan Simmons meets


So he never really existed


Edited by Rabbit (10/15/13 05:11 AM)

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#150891 - 10/15/13 12:02 PM Re: The Abominable - reviewed [Re: Peter McKenna]
Dan Simmons Administrator Offline
CEO of the Hegemony


Registered: 09/02/05
Posts: 10006
Loc: Colorado
 Originally Posted By: Peter McKenna
http://www.markhorrell.com/blog/2012/what-climbing-everest-taught-me-about-george-mallorys-final-hours/

I know this is anecdotal and speculation, but, based on the location of Mallory's body, the missing photograph of his wife, the fact that Irvine's body wasn't near Mallory's, Odell's observation of Mallory and Irvine (allegedly) climbing the second step, Mallory's goggles weren't donned, and Odell's reported late time for Mallory's assault on the second step, it is very likely Mallory got summit fever and summitted Everest, then, possibly due to the late hour, he and Irvine may gave tried to wait out the night, or even tried to descend in semi darkness (doubtful), and, suffering from hypoxia, cerebral edema, or both, Mallory and Irvine fell during the descent, at different locations.

Edmund Hillary said, to climb Everest, one must complete the descent. He also said that it wasn't important which of them (he or Norgay) summitted first, that they (both Hillary and Norgay) summitted together, although he said he clearly remembers leading, and summitting first. You are absolutely right in that Hillary would not defer to Mallory, since that might diminish his own accomplishment, nominally the first man to summit Everest. But (imo) if Hillary were honest, I believe he would admit that Mallory likely summitted in 1924.


DS comments:

I won't get in an argument with you here re: whether Mallory and Irvine summited Everest in 1924, but let it be known that all of your "evidence" listed above has been considered and weighed by those experts who don't believe they did.

Odell's last glimpse of them "climbing the Second Step" has been all but discarded -- even by Odell before he died. He actually said he thought they were crossing the snowfield below the summit pyramid, which would have been absolutely impossible given their late start that morning.

The goggles were in Mallory's pocket because they were descending through the tricky rockband either at twilight or, much more likely, after dark. There was no moon that night and Mallory and Irvine had forgotten to bring the flashlights or flares that had been schlepped up to Camp VI. Bivouacking high on Everest given the primitive state of their equipment -- silk and cotton and wool, no sleeping bags -- would have meant certain death.

The position of Mallory's body means only that he fell from somewhere below the high ridge; finding their camp at night would have meant winding their way through the right rock passage amidst scores of them. The snapped rope still attached to Mallory's body says that they were still roped together when one or both of them fell, almost certainly pulling the other man off.

The absence of Irvine's body near Mallory's after 75 years means almost nothing. His body may have dropped the entire 6,000 feet to the glacier. Or it might have been "the English dead" a Chinese climber described to a Japanese climber -- a dead man in 1920's garb sitting up against a rock very near the ridge top, his body well preserved except for one cheek eaten away by the high-altitude ravens. The climber who made that claim died in an avalanche weeks after telling the western climber.

Most climbers agree that -- a)Mallory and Irvine left their tent at Camp VI far too late to summit that day, especially with the obstacle of the Second Step to overcome b) they would have had to repel down the Second Step if they'd climbed above it and there was no sign of pitons or rotted rope -- no signs at all -- found during later Northeast Ridge climbs c) Mallory would have NEVER left Sandy Irvine, essentially a novice climber, alone on the mountain . . . "summit fever" or no summit fever.

The missing photo of Ruth, Mallory's wife, means little. He would have left it at their "highest point" (he promised her he would never return to attempt Everest again after the '24 Expedition) wherever he and Irvine would have turned around.

It's pleasant to believe that Mallory and Irvine made the summit of Everest in 1924, but the evidence weighs very heavily against it. (We'd know if anyone ever finds the Kodak Vest Camera carried by Mallory but not on his body when he was found. If there were summit photos, they'd be on there. Experts at Kodak say that the film almost certainly could still be developed.)

That camera is an important element of THE ABOMINABLE.

ds

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#150895 - 10/15/13 12:53 PM Re: The Abominable - reviewed [Re: Dan Simmons]
Shrike1 Online   content
old hand


Registered: 09/27/05
Posts: 1136
Loc: Greenville, NC
 Originally Posted By: Dan Simmons
That camera is an important element of THE ABOMINABLE.

ds


I am now cursing myself for my impatience. I downloaded the iBooks preview on Friday, October 11 and read the introduction thinking I would be able to pace myself until the 22nd by reading a few pages here and there. I should have known better.

I finished Part 1: THE CLIMBERS (Four chapters, 113 pages) Sunday afternoon and now I have to wait an entire week to pick back up the journey of Jake, Jean-Claude & the Deacon!

In the meantime I'm going to be watching THE WILDEST DREAM via Netflix and doing some research on Everest.

Greg
_________________________
Words can't define what I feel inside
Who needs them? -- Smashing Pumpkins "GEEK U.S.A."

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#150896 - 10/15/13 12:54 PM Re: The Abominable - reviewed [Re: Rabbit]
Enright Online   content
Pooh-Bah


Registered: 05/17/06
Posts: 2309
Loc: CA
 Originally Posted By: Rabbit
 Originally Posted By: Enright
Well, I made the mistake on a whim of going on Amazon and looking at the Abominable and reading the fascinating introduction, so I'm in a dither until the book comes out. Not knowing diddly about him, I was so drawn to Mr. Perry, the real-life mountaineer, and I kept thinking how fortunate it was that he was still alive when Dan met him and all, one of the great coincidences, and I really wished that I had had a chance to know him too. Now (as in the meaning of now to be the present), I understand some people are insisting that the great and aforementioned Mr. Perry is a fictional character, of all the absurd things, and I just want to shake some sense into them. NOOOOO way.


So, Mr Jake Perry is not a fictional character and Mr Simmons really did meet with him?

ps

Sorry for the post, I found the answer myself, I quote from amazon:

 Quote:
Editorial Reviews
From Publishers Weekly
Even Jake Perry, the fictional travelogue author Dan Simmons meets


So he never really existed


The point of my ironical post was that people, such as whoever it was above who said, "Jake Perry, the fictional travelogue author," are glaringly wrong beyond redemption, and should spend some time in the primordial ooze and start over, but not by course or necessity any of those who may have been led astray by their misdirections, I would think.


Edited by Enright (10/15/13 01:28 PM)
_________________________
Jim


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#150899 - 10/15/13 02:09 PM Re: The Abominable - reviewed [Re: Shrike1]
steele,rick Online   content
Pooh-Bah


Registered: 07/30/11
Posts: 1864
Loc: Sarasota, Florida
I'm just going to wait for my brother to visit the Boulder Book Store next week and buy a signed copy for me. Talk about a nice Christmas present!
_________________________
It's better to be wrong than to be vague. In trial & error, the error is the true essential. F Dyson

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#150902 - 10/15/13 03:00 PM Re: The Abominable - reviewed [Re: steele,rick]
Shrike1 Online   content
old hand


Registered: 09/27/05
Posts: 1136
Loc: Greenville, NC
 Originally Posted By: steele,rick
I'm just going to wait for my brother to visit the Boulder Book Store next week and buy a signed copy for me. Talk about a nice Christmas present!


I am hoping to receive word from the Tattered Cover next week that my (hopefully inscribed w/doodle) copy of THE ABOMINABLE is ready to ship to North Carolina.

Greg
_________________________
Words can't define what I feel inside
Who needs them? -- Smashing Pumpkins "GEEK U.S.A."

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#150903 - 10/15/13 03:09 PM Re: The Abominable - reviewed [Re: Shrike1]
Peter McKenna Offline
old hand


Registered: 06/07/13
Posts: 783
Loc: Louisiana
 Originally Posted By: Shrike1
 Originally Posted By: steele,rick
I'm just going to wait for my brother to visit the Boulder Book Store next week and buy a signed copy for me. Talk about a nice Christmas present!


I am hoping to receive word from the Tattered Cover next week that my (hopefully inscribed w/doodle) copy of THE ABOMINABLE is ready to ship to North Carolina.

Greg


I also am eagerly awaiting a signed copy I purchased from, whatever the bookshop's name is, in Redondo Beach, that will deliver it. W/Doodle? I'm afraid to ask.
_________________________
Peter McKenna

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#150924 - 10/16/13 01:34 AM Re: The Abominable - reviewed [Re: Peter McKenna]
NiņoViento Offline
enthusiast


Registered: 10/12/10
Posts: 222
Loc: Spain
I'm actually surprised at enjoying so much my ebook version of THE ABOMINABLE, not only because Mr. Simmons absorbing tale but also because the gadget I am reading it on allows me to click on the text and see, via Google Earth, the actual shape of the referred mountains or, via Google itself, how a whymper tent looks like, for instance.

NV

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#150930 - 10/16/13 08:43 AM Re: The Abominable - reviewed [Re: NiņoViento]
Rabbit Offline
enthusiast


Registered: 01/29/12
Posts: 116
 Originally Posted By: NiņoViento
I'm actually surprised at enjoying so much my ebook version of THE ABOMINABLE, not only because Mr. Simmons absorbing tale but also because the gadget I am reading it on allows me to click on the text and see, via Google Earth, the actual shape of the referred mountains or, via Google itself, how a whymper tent looks like, for instance.

NV

There is just no denying certain advantages when purchasing ebooks.....however I just cannot make the change, I do have some ebooks on my android, but only because I struggled to source paper.
To me nothing beats the feel of a book in my hands.

Off course I will only see my hardcover closer to the end of the month \:\(

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#150934 - 10/16/13 11:07 AM Re: The Abominable - reviewed [Re: Enright]
Dan Simmons Administrator Offline
CEO of the Hegemony


Registered: 09/02/05
Posts: 10006
Loc: Colorado
 Originally Posted By: Enright
 Originally Posted By: Rabbit
 Originally Posted By: Enright
Well, I made the mistake on a whim of going on Amazon and looking at the Abominable and reading the fascinating introduction, so I'm in a dither until the book comes out. Not knowing diddly about him, I was so drawn to Mr. Perry, the real-life mountaineer, and I kept thinking how fortunate it was that he was still alive when Dan met him and all, one of the great coincidences, and I really wished that I had had a chance to know him too. Now (as in the meaning of now to be the present), I understand some people are insisting that the great and aforementioned Mr. Perry is a fictional character, of all the absurd things, and I just want to shake some sense into them. NOOOOO way.


So, Mr Jake Perry is not a fictional character and Mr Simmons really did meet with him?

ps

Sorry for the post, I found the answer myself, I quote from amazon:

 Quote:
Editorial Reviews
From Publishers Weekly
Even Jake Perry, the fictional travelogue author Dan Simmons meets


So he never really existed


The point of my ironical post was that people, such as whoever it was above who said, "Jake Perry, the fictional travelogue author," are glaringly wrong beyond redemption, and should spend some time in the primordial ooze and start over, but not by course or necessity any of those who may have been led astray by their misdirections, I would think.


Dan Simmons comments:

Some of the reviewers mentioned here, including PW, stated in their revieews that the novel "takes place in 1924", which is incorrect. The expedition was in 1925. One of the reviews, perhaps the same Publishers Weekly review, also states baldly that my trio of climbers go to Mt. Everest to "discover what happened to George Mallory and Irvine" --which is dead wrong. The trio is hired by Lady Bromley to go to Everest in 1925 (there were no formal British expeditions to Everest between the disastrous year of 1924 and 1933) to "rescue" her son, Lord Percival Bromley -- a rescue that our climbers know is impossible -- or to recover his body.

Re: Jake Perry's existence or non-existence, you might take note of my dedication of the novel:

TO JACOB (JAKE) WILLIAM PERRY
1902-1992

(Then an appropriate line of verse.)

Would I have dedicated a major novel to a fictional character?

ds

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